Episode III Ponderings I

[Ternian]

Anakin betrays Sidious.


Enjoy.

[Bandersnatch]

I hear he's going to do that in Episode 6.

[darthpsychotic]

more like Empire Strikes Back

[Tim Lehrbach]

I'm guessing Anakin is just using Palpatine to further his own power, and Anakin knows about the unborn child, but doesn't admit as much to Palps.

Which is basically what happens again in ESB.

[Tim Lehrbach]

I've given up hope of an explosion of spoilers until the script or novel leaks all over the web...so i'm going with it.

For those without connections, I think the hope is, play desperate and stupid, and maybe get a scrap of info or pic you can use to satisfy your curiosity.

[l-0-l]

Betray is an awfully string word, it's more than goes against ones wishes. I know it has been said that Sidious isn't happy with the way anikin "turns out".

[vanillazinger]

Fatboy, there's the assumption that if spoilers stay within the hardcore fan community and don't leak into the more mainstream movie press, the Powers That Be will let it slide. But a full core-dump might trigger an internet avalanche that puts spoilers in front of the public at large, a situation that is not likely to slide. So drips and drops and riddles are a method of obfuscation to keep the spoilage contained. (I don't know how much it actually works, but that's the assumption.)

[darthpsychotic]

MF being on and offline during the past few days had nothing to do with traffic but had to do with the webhost.

[Jedi Master Matt]

Of course Anakin betrays Sidious...

It's one of the biggest points of the OT. Anakin was never completely gone - when it comes to his family.

My guess is that Anakin lies to Palps to protect his family's future.

[I_SHOT_JR]

not more Greedos



Discuss.

Not to question the great Chyren, but he actually had to go in and have a brain tumor removed from his head shortly after making those comments so...

[Bandersnatch]

Tony Montana's Avatars.



Discuss...

[stan Marsh]

Maybe Anakin goes and betrays Sidious before he realises that he is Palps, then when Mace goes and confronts him and or Yoda, Palps explains he is Sidious and then Anakin rushes in for the defence...

Just an Idea...

it's not really a betrayal if anakin doesn't know he is betraying him

[Vanda]

As usual, I echo Fatboy.

Discuss.

[darthpsychotic]

I'm not sure what FR is saying because it appears to me that he is all over the map.

Hard Copy and Spoileriffic dictate how and when their stuff is posted and we honor their requests.

[Vanda]

Hard Copy and Spoileriffic dictate how and when their stuff is posted and we honor their requests.

That is obviously their choice and I respect that, DP. mecha hit the nail.

[Ethril]

Ponderings, huh?


why do we have cuticles? Really. C'mon.

Do you know it's almost impossible to find a T-shirt with JUST the Star Wars logo on it, and not all that other screenprinted swap-meet bedspread looking bullshit all over it?

Does 3-d CGI Popeye really need to exist? And has anyone seen those old x-rated Popeye comic strips? I guess they were really popular at one time.

children being raised in this age are starting to say things like "LOL" "ROTFL" and "PWN3D" out loud in their regular vocabulary. Does this frighten you as much as it frightens me?

Incredibles or Spider Man 2--which is the better comic book movie?

Discuss

1) Why would you devote as much thought to cuticles, might be a better question.

2) I have a lovely t-shirt with just the ROTS logo.. got it at Suncoast.

3) I just recently saw CGI Popeye.. it is truely and abomination.

4) ROTFL is scary.. LOL not so much. I'm still not sure what PWN3D means, but I'd be curious as to whether the 3 is pronounced differently than E..

5)Incredibles.

[I_SHOT_JR]

So THAT'S why he was such an infrequent visitor afterwards.


Is he okay now? Why doesn't he visit us anymore?






.... or does he? And do we not realize it?

I don't know, I don't know, and I don't know. He posted those "hints" and next thing I heard he was going in for brain surgery and things didn't look too bright.

[Shiban]

Anakin lets Obi Wan go.


"You should not have come back."

My guess is that Sids orders Obi Wan killed. Vader at this time finds Obi and confronts him. Obi Wan could tell him that his son is dead or safely hidden away. Of course it makes more sense to have him think that Luke is dead so that Vader doesn't force him to tell him where he is at, but sees him as harmless by himself. Thus he lets him go and tells him not to come back.

That may be how he betrays Sidious.

Now you may say "but the spoiler says Anakin is the one who betrays Sids, not Vader".

It is the last act of Anakin Sywalker. Anakin Skywalker Ceased to exist and became Darth Vader.

I know this is pure speculation, but that's what this is for.

Kind of odd that this was the very first topic I ever created at TFn (under a slightly different alias) around May/June '00 and now it's my first post here. Time flies when there's Star Wars involved.

[darthpsychotic]

Hardcopy/spoileriffic requested Ternian to throw a one sentence hint at the SW fan community, and leave us hanging?

Here's how it went down.

- Hard Copy provided Ternian some Episode 3 excerpts and T started the daily reports.
- People bitched.
- Hard Copy asked that the reports be scaled down to weekly.
- People bitched.
- T then posted the teaser spoiler and MF went offline again due to host issues.
- People bitched.
- T had some real life stuff to deal with and didn't provide teaser spoiler support.
- People bitched.

[Shiban]

^^^^^^^^^^Nope.

May I ask why you hold this position?

Why is my theory faulty?

[Shiban]

Because if anyone is on top of rumors, spoilers, and known facts about Episode III -- it's mecha superior.

Ok, since I don't Mecha, I can accept that, but that still doesn't answer my question. Just because someone is up on their spoilers doesn't explain why my theory isn't feasible.

Is there info (already known) that contradicts it? I'm not questioning anyone here. I'm just here discuss along with everyone else.

Why doesn't this theory work?

[Ternian]

Ya know, its kinda funny. I don't remember sending invitations out saying you HAD to come to this site...

[Forcechoke]

Here's something everyone needs:

.


^it's a grain of salt. If you really are so worried about getting your spoilers all at once and real deal 100% entirely accurate, come back in early April.

[Ternian]

Mecha, Anakin betrays Sidious.

[Ternian]

Yes, let's get this straight. Vader/Anakin betrays Sidious - I don't think he is totally to the Dark Side at this point - there is still and inner conflict and a belief he can fix things.

"Anakin get's more corrupt as he tries to use the darkside to do a noble act?"

Pretty much. He just fucks things up badly and is too far gone to turn back. He needs Luke in RotJ.

[VT-16]

I noticed the name of the thread is Ponderings 1. Does this mean we´re in for Ponderings 2 & 3, as well?

And for those who wonder:

POWN3D is used whenever one is utterly defeated, for instance "MF.com has POWN3D TFN time and time again".

[Ternian]

Anakin aint really concentraing on doing good in this film.

From a certain point of view...lol

[VT-16]

From a certain point of view...lol

AAARRRGGGHHH

[Ethril]

oh, and an ROTS shirt isn't what I was asking about. I said STAR WARS logo. JUST a STAR WARS logo. not an ROTS logo. it's damn near IMPOSSIBLE to find just a black shirt with a plain STAR WARS logo on it anywhere. I don't even know if they were ever really made outside of bootleggers in the 70's.

That's true.. I have no idea why that is. But my ROTS shirt gives me warm fuzzies, so I'm good.

[Bandersnatch]

Tony Montana's Avatars give me warm fuzzies...

[Ethril]

OMG, brainfart.. They do indeed make the shirt you are looking for, if you don't mind the letters being silver.. I have one.. It came out in '97 for the SE.. I have actually seen quite a few of them... Plain black shirts, with JUST the words "Star Wars" done in kind of a plasticy silver.. but very cool. I dunno.. try eBay or something.. mine was ruined by bleach back a ways, but I saw somebody with one of the same shirts in the OT DVD line just this year.. I asked him and he said it was from '97, also.

[kremzike]

I know it's not exactly what you're looking for, Fatboy, and there's a good chance you've already seen it. But, just in case, this one here isn't too bad. Just mentioning it here in case you hadn't seen it yet.

[darthvodka]

Has anyone ever mentioned that the name Padme is part ot a Tibetan Buddhist mantra to remove suffering - Om Mani Padme Hung?

"....Päd, the fourth syllable, helps to achieve perfection of perseverance, Me helps achieve perfection in the practice of concentration,...."

For example, the syllable Pad purifies the attachment to stupidity and prejudice, Me purifies Poverty and Possessiveness


mad as fuck

http://www.dharma-haven.org/tibetan/mea ... e-hung.htm

[Ternian]

Everything happens before the duel begins...then it just simply gets worse after that.

[benfett]

yeah thats why the duels at the end of the movie, of course "it" happens before the duel begins, whatever "it" is. I think you've just gone and confused everyone that visits this site with what you're doing here!

[Forcechoke]

This is the most "state the obvious" thread I've ever seen on mf.

[darthpsychotic]

or the x-boards or the official site or tbones or sombrero

[benfett]

exactly, and now I've come to find that ponderings 1 is just that, one ponder. There will be no more "ponders"! Shit, who needs 'em.

Why would you tell us everything happens before the duel begins, everyone on here knows that the duel is the last part of the movie!

[Thorz Hamer I]

you know I came back to this site after my first viewing because it seemed like it was free of all the petty little bullshit kid games that is rampant on other sites that will go unmentioned by me. But now it seems like we are getting all of that and more here and I for think its sucks... if you have Info and know its true or it comes from a reliable source ...SPILL !

No more little word games or riddles, just tell us what you know.... we would TELL you and everyone else if WE knew... That is all we are asking... Treat us like equals and not lessors that you can choose if and when to devulge information.


Over.

[HST]

You know what? I agree with FR its just silly the little shadow games that are being played. Ternian keeps implying he knows more than hes spilling. And that implies that hes holding something back. Which everytime i here him say stuff like 'from a certain point of view' or any such implications just makes me loose interest and move on the the other threads where people actually might make headway. It just reminds me of the TFN ppl who sometimes leak into this site and start making cryptic posts thinking they are cool.

[Oota Toota Rogo?]

I have been following this board for a while now and I really do enjoy it, even though the spoilers are more ambiguous than I would like. As to the ponderings perhaps the "Anakin betrays Sidious" angle is that Anakin tells Sidious that Obi-wan was killed in the duel. One way or another, it makes sense that the betrayal would be a "throw the emperor off the scent" type of manuever on the part of Anakin/Vader.

As to the "Harcopy" spoilers of the last month I can only say "Wow". This movie will have some depth and texture as compared to the last two. I say this because:

1.) Anakin has a vision that his Mom dies.
2.) She dies.
3.) Anakin has a vision that Padme dies
4.) Anakin finds a way to avert that death (Darth Plaguies)
5.) Pursuing that course "causes" Padme's death

6.) Conclusion: Sideous now has Anakin/Vader on a chain forever by saying, Serve me and "maybe" I'll bring her back. I may teach the trick you if you do my bidding. Thus the final act of throwong the Emperor down the 2nd Death Star pits in ROTJ is his final "letting go" of Padme as well as saving Luke.

Its just my guess based on what I have seen so far.

[robbie_20002002]

Seconds out, round 2. Ding, ding!

[vanillazinger]

I don't mind the cockteasing. I'm in it because it's fun to piece together the tidbits and try to guess what the final story is going to be. Frankly, I have no idea if the actual movie is going to be any good or suck balls - there's not an insignificant possibility of the latter. So dropping the whole thing in my lap at once isn't necessarily a guarantee of enjoyment. However, putting together the puzzle has been consistently enjoyable to me for two years running.

I'm confident the answers will come soon enough. I can wait until Tern wants to spill. One way or another, all of this is going to be meaningless in a couple of months anyway.

[Slug]

Here we go again, Unfortunately I was one of the massacred Decembers.
But now that I am back I would like to say that this is the best site for SW diss anywhere out there. I hate TFN & OS boards with a passion. Nothing but wannabe SW fans under the age of 12. I agree with FR in his belief about the spoilers, if you have them then show them. No matter what news or spoilers that may come, there will always be SOMETHING to talk about! Even without topics provided I believe that between all the SW minds that live in these boards we can come up with something. I say give it all now & if you dont, then you really dont have anything to give at all.

[Shiban]

We could rattle on all day about this. It is pretty vague.

Just a couple of thoughts.

Anakin's turn serves dual purposes.

1: To save Padme. Once he finds out that Sidious has the key, and he knows that Palps=Sidious, he wants it. Selfish reason, but a reason none-the-less.

2: To balance the force. He has been force-fed this chosen one talk since he was introduced to the Jedi. He knows that he is supposedly the one. Think about it, if you know that you are the end all and be all, you'd get a little reckless. He probably thinks that he can take sidious out, because he is meant to. The only way to destroy the Sith is to do it from the inside. And so he goes inside, not knowing that there is no escape.(yet)

The major problem with this is the Temple. You can't do something that evil and still consider yourself on the side of right can you? Of course through his twisted logic it may seem a small price to pay for the eradication of the Sith. Or does he make Palps believe that the temple has been cleaned out, when in fact Yoda and Obi Wan have cleared the younlings to safety. Once the kids aren't being trained anymore, it's kind of hard to become a Jedi I would think.

And now back to Letting Obi Wan go. Couldn't Anakin sacrifice himself knowing full well that Palpatine would save him using his special abilities?

Just trying to digest this small tidbit. There are many ways that he could betray him. And I"m sure none of mine are close :p

[vanillazinger]

Well, I don't pretend that my viewpoint is anything close to common around these parts. In general I hate spoilers with a passion. My participation in Ep3 spoilerdom is a total fluke. Were it not for the EU contract that led me here, I wouldn't have spent two hours thinking about ROTS before next May. I got hooked because of the speculation, fueled by many juicy spy reports and the insane daily barrage provided by Hyperspace. Piecing together two years of random Pablo tidbits, peering at set details in webdocs, straining to read scene numbers on clappers - that's where I've got my jollies all this time. My enjoyment of spy reports is how they fit together pieces of the puzzle that have eluded me and how they drive further speculation. Honestly, if you handed me the novelization right now I might not even read it. I'd be anxious for answers to questions I've had, but the actual story is only of secondary interest. It's just a cheesy adventure flick. Once I know everything, my fun is over until May.

Actually, that's not really true. I probably would read the novel, so I could tell you guys about it. This community has provided me with more fun than any movie ever could, and I greatly appreciate that. Frankly I think it's odd as shit that people complain about spoilers being spread out rather than dumped all at once, when this whole community has been a blast for me precisely because it's spread out my anticipation of a SW movie over two years, that otherwise would have excited me for about a week at release and maybe another day or two when the DVD comes out.

So I say Ternian, keep on doing what you're doing. And I say the same thing to Hard Copy, Spoilerriffic, Josh Griffin, Fatboy, Ewok Pudu, Art Maul, Pablo Hidalgo, LFL marketing and everyone else who have delivered the goods. Do it in whatever way makes you happy. It's all good to me.

[Ternian]

From HARDCOPY to Fatboy:


"Think, dude. And if you still can't see the difference between publishing the whole stuff (which is theft) and publishing single scenes (almost without quotes!) to provoke intelligent discussion and feed the community with at least small bits of truth about their beloved movie (oh, you'll see that's not an overstatement!), then think again or ask someone. Unless you can't bear intelligent discussion or truth. And don't worry, you'll not be getting the whole thing from me over next 3 months. It's just not going to happen. Spoilers are fun. Some of us need them like air. You may not like them but then... why do you visit a spoiler forum? Now chill out, have a beer and enjoy the news while they last "

[Zidious]

to provoke intelligent discussion and feed the community

I used to have fun with the drip drip of spoilers. But it's been more than six years of this stuff and I'm somewhat exhausted. "I'm getting too old for this sort of thing."

[Rogue_Six]

In a way, I agree with vanillazinger - I enjoy the speculation the spoilers create... However, what I don't enjoy are the mindless threads & debates such as whether or not Yoda farts, etc, etc... I think that was Fatboy's point. I can see it both ways.

[Ternian]

what people are BITCHING about is this Griffin-lite BULLSHIT. And the answer that "I don't remember saying you HAD to come to this site" bullshit. As if anyone comes to this site for fucking Ternian.

It's funny how personal you make all this Fatboy. All you do is whinge...and everybody is getting fucking sick of it. If you don't like how the spoilers are flowing - fuck off; it's really that easy.

The people here are too old, been in this too long, and are too tired with all the retarded puzzle game bullshit to be expected to play along now. Especially coming from Ternian, who seems more concerned with the trimmings of how this info gets out than the actual info itself.

Big, bad boy Ternian...same shit, different place. Get over it.

He's fucking coming on his stomach because he knows something, and he's feeding into this retarded ego-trip bullshit that most of us came here TO ESCAPE IN THE FIRST PLACE.

Gee whiz...yep. Big ego trip here. Woo-yeah.


The problem with you Fatboy is that you act like a child who doesn't get what they want, you think that if you chuck a tantrum long enough, and loud enough, you'll get what you want...